The following is a rushed transcript and may contain errors. A proofread version will be made available as soon as possible.

Marc Steiner:

Welcome to the Marc Steiner Show here on The Real News. I’m Marc Steiner. It’s great to have you all with this. One of my great passions in life is Cuba and I’ve been to Cuba numerous times and now it’s at the center of Trump attacking Cuba again and trying to isolate it and want to try to overthrow the Cuban government. All that’s taking place as we speak and we are lucky to have today our guest, Liz Oliva Fernández, who is a Cuban journalist and documentary filmmaker. She joined us from a vanity today. Her film won the Gracie Award for Alliance Women, the media award directed Uphill on the Hill heartland of the Hudson, and through her work at Billy the Beast, she reports on all the issues going on in Cuba, what it’s facing and more. And we’ll be linking to all of that because you don’t want to miss our documentary work, which is amazing. And Liz, welcome. Good to have you with us.

Liz Oliva Fernández:

Thank you. Thank you very much. It’s a pleasure for me being here with you today.

Marc Steiner:

So Cuba and the United States have had a long, intertwined, tangled and sometimes violent history together from the very beginning, late 19th century. So I want to just begin by asking you to describe for us what it’s like being in Cuba now given the sanctions, given the threats by Trump to overthrow the government and trying to isolate Cuba from the rest of the world once again. So give us a sense of what it feels like it is like to be there at this moment.

Liz Oliva Fernández:

Well, it’s really difficult, but first I would like to start saying people in Cuba doesn’t have any resentment with the people in the United States. We have a lot of history in common. I think Cuban people love everyone who are coming from outside and trying to share with them whatever we have at that moment. And I think that is not different with the people from the United States. If you’re coming to Cuba, if you’re visiting Cuba, you know that people welcome you and welcome you as citizens with more of the warm that we can be. But Cuba has been having a difficult relation with the government of the United States. That’s different, not because we have, and we can’t call this a confrontation because we are not a threat to the United States of America. We don’t represent a threat to no one in the United States, not for the government, not for the people.

And also Cuba is a really small island in the Caribbean. There is no way that we actually can do some damage or in some way re return the damage of the US government with his policy has him on Cuba. So right now, this is the last wave of the Donald Trump administration. And I say last wave of sanctions and pressure because in the first theme, Donald Trump already start to increase the sanctions in Cuba to design the sanctions in Cuba, on Cuba in a way that actually came her the most to the Cuban people. And right now the situation is critical because the oil bulk is critical because we haven’t received any oil shipment since December. I think that the given president mentioned in the last comparisons, again with the mainstream media outlets. So every country around the world needs oil to run. So right now we have long blackouts. I think it is less long than the last week because right now they just showed up the public transportation completely. So people have to use it moving around like walking, trying to get a private taxi. We call it alro, the kind of collective taxes that are around the city. But the prices are not ide. So there are people who actually can’t pay for that prices because the shortage of UL of course, that the price is going to be higher. Now a lot of the people who are non-essential state workers are now at home, most of them working half hours or working in a different way. But many of them doesn’t have figured out the payment has going to be the schools. There is a lot of school that university for example, send the kids to their homes and now the class is going to be online. That for me, I’m not understanding really well how it’s going to work because when we have black housing in Cuba, we also have problem with the connection.

You better going to have connection and you’re not able to make calls or sending texts. It’s really complicated. So I don’t know how all the students are going to have actually online classes if they’re in the blackout. And the internet is really difficult too. So I don’t know what kind of designs they’re going to apply there. But for sure it is full of obstacles. Also hospitals, they’re working, but with the essential service, it’s a kind of pandemic economic crisis. Mix it in one bowl. There is a lot of uncertainty, anxiety with people because it’s not like the most of us are just living day by day because we are not sure what is going to be tomorrow. For now, the streets are calm, people looks like calm,

Trying to get through the day. One thing that people have to understand is the blackouts are not new for sure are not new for Cubans are not new. In the last couple of weeks we have been facing a black house in the last year, most frequently that it was before. Because before all of this start, like this new wave I was sharing, there was a lot of things that was happening. There was a lot of the pressure that the United States was trying to push with Cuba. They were trying to cut all the ways that Cuba has received incomes in order to stop Cuba, to have money, to do things, to buy things, oil, food, medicines. And we have been really focused in the last year to cover and to report on the impact of the sanctions, the healthcare system because has been really impacted. And we have to remember that the 60% of the medications that we used to have in Cuba are, we’re producing inside of Cuba for Cuban people. And right now you barely can’t find acetaminophen for pain. That’s unthinkable for a country like Cuba that is capable to design and to create their own vaccines against COVID-19. That you don’t have a painkillers for their own people.

Marc Steiner:

No, because people don’t realize that Cuba has one of the most vaunted and thorough health systems in the entire world.

Liz Oliva Fernández:

The way that is structured and the way that is public, but also universal. You can have a doctor just walking distance from your home and a clinic is unthinkable for many people around the world. But that’s something that Kiva accomplished. And we used to be the country with more doctors per capita. That was Cuba.

Marc Steiner:

That

Liz Oliva Fernández:

Was Cuba. So right now we have personnel who take care of us. They don’t have the medicines, they don’t have the things that they need to actually take care well, of the people.

Marc Steiner:

So okay, may ask you this, as you were speaking, I was thinking that Donald Trump and the right wing in America will be in power for at least the next two to four years at the very least, which impacts our country negatively. But it’s really impacting Cuba deeply. So I’m curious, how do you think Cuba survives this? I mean, if Donald Trump had his way, if the right wing had their way, they’d be invading Cuba now to overthrow the government, take over the island and bring all the exploitation back to Cuba, that’s what they would do. So I’m curious, what’s your analysis than thought about what happens now?

Liz Oliva Fernández:

Well, that’s my worst scenario case.

And the first thought that is coming to our minds is if that happens, Cuba will never be free again. Because I think like United States going to make sure that if they lose in Cuba once they’re going to lose it twice. I think that they’re going to extend the collective punishment forever. But I actually want, I need to believe that Cuba is going to survive to this. We are survivors like the whole Cuban population. But the situation is really critical. There’s a lot of things that is happening at the same time and there is a lot of psychological effects of the living under US sanctions for more than 60 years. But on the other hand, I have to say that I was really inspiring in the last couple of weeks when the government organizes demonstration and you have this homage to the 32 Cubans who die in Venezuela. I was really touched because for the first time in many years in Cuba, I see people that really move for something that was happened inside of Cuba. Because with all this crisis, people just get political and they don’t want to know nothing about politics or getting involved

Or showing whatever they have. They just was more will to express their dis with the country around the situation. And that’s clear, that’s one of the goal of the sanctions, like trying to overthrow the government, but not from the outside. You’re not trying to overthrow the government trying to ate people in a way that they want to overthrow their own government. That’s the end game. But for the first time in many years, I really see people to feeling what they were saying they were actually supporting to the Cuban government. And I didn’t expect that. And I was really shocked because I know that people are tired. I know that people need someone to blame and that’s going to be the Cuban government because who else? Sanctions are too big to confused. They don’t understand exactly how the sanctions affect their life, where have to do a government that is 90 miles away from my country, from my daily day basis.

People don’t understand that. And they are the most of the time too busy trying to survive the day by day. But now the sanctions have been increased. That’s true. But they have been increasing from the last couple of years, 10 years. So for the first time, the things that actually is changing is the way that they speak, the way that they’re trying to explain to people about why this is necessary. So they are talking about freedom at the end, but they’re talking about sacrifice. They’re talking about, well, if your mother is hunger or if your kid doesn’t have any medications, it’s necessary. This is the price that we need to pay more to get freedom to Cuba. And people in Cuba is like, are you saying that from the United States? Are you asking us to put our bodies to try to go through this? Are you crazy? And something that have Cuba also is understanding about history. And history has been shown that every country that the United States has visited or has trying to free, in some ways they left the country worse when they found out.

Marc Steiner:

Right.

Liz Oliva Fernández:

The speech about freedom is something that people in Latin America are too familiar too. And we can talk about dictatorships when United States has been packed, every dictatorship in Latin America in the last century. So what we are talking about here for the first time, mark, this is something that is more clear than ever that the impact that the sanctions has. There’s not they saying anymore, no, this sanctions is not impacting the people. It’s just impacting the government. No, because now we are talking about a new wave of sanctions and you say, well, you have to suffer this in order to get a better tomorrow. And that’s, I think makes people in Cuba actually open their eyes really openly, widely in the same way this has been alive my entire thing.

Marc Steiner:

So you have experienced the United States a lot in your life and work. You’ve been here a lot back and forth. You have a serious analysis about where this government’s going. And so I’m curious where you think this takes Cuba and the United States. I mean, I’ve been following Cuba for a long time, over 60 years. That makes me old, but that’s okay. Over 60 years I’ve been following Cuba and been part of it. But this to me seems to be with this right wing in racist government, in power in the United States and Cuba is a threat for those people. So I wonder how you think that plays out? I mean, how long can Cuba withstand the pressure and the isolation? Because this isolation to me is different and more intense than anything Cuba has experienced before since the revolution.

Liz Oliva Fernández:

Yeah, for sure it

Marc Steiner:

Is. So how do you think this plays out? How does Cuba survive this?

Liz Oliva Fernández:

Well, I don’t know. I feel like we can, the key word here is isolation. In my opinion, Cuba can’t survive alone. So we need the people who actually cares about what is going on in Cuba with then in solidarity with Cuba, not just speeches and saying things. I’m talking about actions because what the United States is doing is illegal. It’s illegal. Under the international law. We know that Donald Trump and the Trump administration doesn’t care about international law. But if you say Europe, Western, whatever country that you are coming from that actually said that they care about the international law. If they are being in complicity with the United States, allowing this United States get away with its actions, that means that you’re in complicity with this violation of the international law. Because we are talking about sanctions, but this are not sanctions because sanctions are legal. In the international law, we are talking about unilateral, coercive measures applies by the United States against Cuba. And that’s illegal. So for me, it’s like what the war will to do in order to protect international law, international order, and today speak about Cuba. But we don’t know who’s going to be next. First one it was well, Greenland, Venezuela, Cuba.

And then it’s like this guy thinks that they’re actually unstoppable. They don’t respect nothing. So it’s not just Cuba who has been at risk right now. It’s the whole continent and it’s also the whole world. If we don’t make them respect the law, I’m trying to say, okay, you don’t rule wrong the war, you can be a really big umpire, but you don’t wrong the war. You don’t run our life. So if we don’t know how to put them and stop, that’s going to be a disaster. Not just for Cuba, but for the rest of the world.

Marc Steiner:

Because, I’m sorry. So what do you think that people can do in terms of what solidarity looks like today and what can people do beyond just concern? I mean, this is, as I said earlier, many people know the Cuba, US relations have been entangled for 150 years. It’s been wrapped around each other. So what can people do beyond their concern and what does solidarity look like to you?

Liz Oliva Fernández:

Well, in my head, it’s like you help as much as you can. There is a lot of organizations and initiatives inside of Cuba that are trying to care by the communities. And that’s the kind of stories that I want to tell. And also important as a journalist, we have too many bad news about what is going on in Cuba. I think that this also is generating and speculation and also a kind of crisis like, oh my God, this is falling apart.

The situation is critical, but we need to stop together and say, okay, what we are going to do? What is kind of the solutions? And maybe as a journalist trying to report on that, because there is a lot of people in Cuba that are taking care of the communities. Maybe this is something from the United States can learn a little bit about. There are people who are trying to find solutions, trying to get renewable energies to God, but using it as a community, trying to grow their own food inside of their own communities in the backyards, trying organizing women, other people, because we are also talking about 25% of the population is elder than 60

Marc Steiner:

In Cuba?

Liz Oliva Fernández:

In Cuba, yeah, in Cuba. So the situation is getting complicated. So for me, the people that can talk don’t talk about Cuba, but talk about, okay, the situation is critical. What we can do in order to help them to try to bring, because of course you can bring oil to Cuba, but maybe you can find a way to initiative in Cuba or something that needs access to solar panels. Maybe this is something that you can do and maybe you can bring food to people or maybe you can bring your experience in other countries that has experienced the same to Cban and share that knowledge with them. The possibilities is whatever is in your mind that you actually can help. And I’m talking about practical things. The news is good. I’m really happy that Cuba’s on the news in the United States right now, that there is a lot of people that are putting on attention in Cuba, but also the amount of bad news also creating a kind of exterior. So I think we need to stay straight about situation is critical, but we need to do something or this help to these people survive because they’re not going to survive alone.

Marc Steiner:

So this is difficult, but how do you see the future playing out for Cuba? I mean, one of the things I learned in my times in Cuba is that the Cuban people, A are very resilient. They’re passionate about your country and your future. It’s phenomenal how Cuba has survived since all the attacks since the 1960s on, and this is probably the worst, I think, as I said earlier, that I’ve ever seen that Cuba’s going through. So I want to politically and humanly how you think Cuba survives this. What does Cuba have to do and what do we have to do to be in solidarity with Cuba to help us survive?

Liz Oliva Fernández:

I don’t know. Certainly I don’t have I idea. How’s it going to be the future? And that’s the things that brings me more anxiety and don’t let me sleep well at night. I want to believe that we don’t going to change too much

As cultural talking. I would like to think that we actually is going to stick together because a lot of people talk about Cubans being resilient or creative people. This is not something that we asking for. This is not something that we have to done because we born this way. This is something that we have been forced to be in order to survive. We just are tired of being resilient and creative and beyond. We just want to live a simple life and to have access to basic things. And I think that this is a key because we are not asking nothing on United States more than just, please stay in your place. Don’t do nothing. We don’t need nothing from you. That’s the deal. But I don’t know it is going to affect us. Of course it’s going to change us. Of course we are going to be better after this. I don’t know. We have say in Spanish, I don’t know how to translate that

Speaker 3:

In English. That’s okay.

Liz Oliva Fernández:

But they say, look, not matter, like the things that don’t kill you make you

Marc Steiner:

Stronger.

Liz Oliva Fernández:

Stronger. But I’m worried about the price that we have to pay in order to be stronger in order to survive to this. That means we are not more emotional, more practical people. I don’t know. I don’t know. But I’m afraid. I’m afraid of the future. I’m afraid of the future generations. I’m afraid of these generations. I’m afraid all their generations, the people who actually believe that builds something in Cuba different from the rest of the world, was worth it. And they stay here and they try to fight for it. And I’m afraid that they just lose that. We lose that.

Marc Steiner:

And if you lose that, the world loses that.

Liz Oliva Fernández:

Yeah,

Marc Steiner:

I just want to say this, that our airwaves, my show, my program here is open to you anytime.

Liz Oliva Fernández:

Oh, thank you.

Marc Steiner:

I think that your voice is important and I think that we have to stand in solidarity with Cuba and the Cuban people and we have to show that to America and the world. And we are here for you as much as we can be. Whatever we can do. Whatever I can do.

Liz Oliva Fernández:

Thank you. We really appreciate it because we actually need it.

Marc Steiner:

Yes, you do. Cuba does. And so we’re there and I’m, we’re going to link to all of your incredible documentary film work because you’re an amazing filmmaker and people need to see it and see Cuba through his eyes. Liz, Olivia Fernandez, who has been our guest, and I deeply appreciate the work you do deeply appreciate you taking your time with us today. And I’ll stand shoulder to shoulder with you wherever it goes.

Liz Oliva Fernández:

Thank you.

Marc Steiner:

Thanks to David Hebden for running the program. Our audio editor, Stephen Frank for working his magic producer, Rosette Ali for making it all work behind the scenes. And everyone here at The Real News for making this show possible. Please let me know what you thought about, what you heard today, what you’d like us to cover. Just write to me at mss@therealnews.com and I’ll get right back to you. So for the crew here at The Real News, I’m Marc Steiner. Stay involved. Keep listening, and take care.